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battlestarone
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2003 11:48 am Reply with quote Back to top

is it not about time that the EU/UK got thre act together and looked into a new uhf cb system on common channels across the EU,this may be an extension to the current 446 channels with a little more power like 10 watts base/mobile use and colinear antennas like the old 934mhz system,i for one would find a system like this very handy for talking to my wife while out at work in my town,10 watts mobile/base would give good local coverage,what do you all think.

regards battlestarone
Tjardick



Joined: 11 Mar 2003
Posts: 105
Location: Belgium

PostPosted: Thu Apr 17, 2003 3:10 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Yeah that would be good, but then just license free like PMR, and indeed with 5-10 watts would be a good idea.

Anybody now how to get the ball rolling at the EU ?

Tj
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Dean



Joined: 11 Mar 2003
Posts: 595
Location: London

PostPosted: Thu Apr 17, 2003 3:21 pm Reply with quote Back to top

It's already underway, there's a lot of pressure on the RA for such a system coming from all angles.

PMR446 is a good stepping stone for this.

5-10 watts with external antenna's is plenty. If the RA are tough on manufacturers, there's absolutely no reason for cross channel interference to be a problem. It's easy to build a well-behaved UHF Transmitter with 12.5khz spaced channels with low deviation.

I personally would not care about losing 500khz allocation in the (already underused) ham 70cms band to a 40 channel UHF system. Especially if they allowed data, repeaters and gateways.

That opens up possibilities for a lot of experimentation without requiring NOV's. Something we wanted to create for PMR446 when we set this up.

Dean
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GrahamG



Joined: 06 Apr 2003
Posts: 200
Location: North East, Newcastle (upon Tyne)

PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2003 9:25 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Dean wrote:
It's already underway, there's a lot of pressure on the RA for such a system coming from all angles.

PMR446 is a good stepping stone for this.

5-10 watts with external antenna's is plenty. If the RA are tough on manufacturers, there's absolutely no reason for cross channel interference to be a problem. It's easy to build a well-behaved UHF Transmitter with 12.5khz spaced channels with low deviation.

I personally would not care about losing 500khz allocation in the (already underused) ham 70cms band to a 40 channel UHF system. Especially if they allowed data, repeaters and gateways.

That opens up possibilities for a lot of experimentation without requiring NOV's. Something we wanted to create for PMR446 when we set this up.

Dean


It would also be nice and would kickstart usage of the system if licensed amateurs were allowed to use their existing 70cms gear on UHF CB as long as they conformed to the spec for this hypothetical UHF CB system when doing so. It would provide a true cross-format link so that amateurs could communicate with non-amateurs.

Amateur self-regulation of power levels to those legal on UHF CB is not a ludicrous or unreasonable thing to suggest, as present M3 and 2xxxxx UK amateur callsigns are expected to operate within the power their license is limited to even when their equipment itself may be able to push out a lot more.

Of course, the main problem there will be that non-amateurs will get hold of amateur 70cms transceivers and start running 50W or more, which will ruin things for everyone else operating within the legal limit as usual.


-GrahamG
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BATTLESTARONE
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2003 12:38 am Reply with quote Back to top

UHF CB IS A VERY WORKABLE IDEA,USING PART OF 70CMS,DONT THINK THAT WILL HAPPEN AS THE MOD HAVE THERE SAY ON WHAT HAPPENS ON 70CMS AND THE BUCK STOPS WITH THEM EVEN BEFORE IT GETS TO THE RA STAGE.

I REALLY THINK MORE CHANNELS ON 446MHZ WOULD DO THE JOB,EVEN JUST USING THE ONCE WE HAVE JUST NOW WITH CTCSS AND DCS CALLING,BUT I AM SURE IN THE FUTURE THAT THIS PART OF THE BAND COULD BE EXTENDED OUT ANOTHER 8 CHANNELS AT 6.25 SPACING,IT HARDLY TAKING UP LOADS OF SPECTRUM,INFACT AT 6.25KC SPACING YOU ARE ONLY TAKING UP 4 12.5KC CHANNELS.

THE RA WOULD NOT HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT QRM TO OTHER USERS AS THE SETS WOULD BE TYPE APPROVED ANY WAY,ONE ONLY HAS TO LOOK AT THE AUSIE CB LINKS AND YOU CAN SEE THAT A SYSTEM LIKE THIS WOULD WORK IN THE UK IF THE PRICE OF THE KITS WAS KEEPED TO A LEVEL THAT DIDNT BUST THE BANK,YOU CAN BUY HIGH GRADE 70CMS MOBILE HAM SETS FOR AROUND 250 OR LESS NEW,AND THE HAM MARKET IN THE UK REALLY IS NOT HUGE,THEREARE ONLY ABOUT 65OOO HAMS IN THE UK,NOT ALL HAVING AN INTREST IN UHF,SO REALLY NO REASON FOR HIGH PRICES ON UHF CB SETS IF IT WERE TO HAPPEN.

WE CAN ONLY LIVE IN HOPE

REGARDS TO ALL
Guest






PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2003 1:48 pm Reply with quote Back to top

it would be a good idea to have UHF CB. there is only one problem just listen on 27 mhz CB.

27mhz CB was a good idea but listen to it now foul mouth adults and kids, music players drug dealing. do i need to continue. and yes I have even heard drug dealing going on, on 446 MHz

so unless someone police's it and prosecutes offenders it would be a waste of time having UHF CB.

Quote:

I personally would not care about losing 500khz allocation in the (already underused) ham 70cms band to a 40 channel UHF system. Especially if they allowed data, repeaters and gateways.


and as a radio ham myself I do mind giving up part of any ham band for the likes of people who do not respect other people on radio.
rope



Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Posts: 36
Location: Hawkinge, Kent

PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2003 2:28 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Quote:

it would be a good idea to have UHF CB. there is only one problem just listen on 27 mhz CB.

27mhz CB was a good idea but listen to it now foul mouth adults and kids, music players drug dealing. do i need to continue. and yes I have even heard drug dealing going on, on 446 MHz

so unless someone police's it and prosecutes offenders it would be a waste of time having UHF CB.

Quote:

I personally would not care about losing 500khz allocation in the (already underused) ham 70cms band to a 40 channel UHF system. Especially if they allowed data, repeaters and gateways.



and as a radio ham myself I do mind giving up part of any ham band for the likes of people who do not respect other people on radio.


----
As a licenced amature I must agree with Graham that I would not mind 500khz being used. You will always get the idiot who wants to ruin the enjoyment of others, On licenced and licence free bands. But it is more than rectified by the good people that use the bands.

An increase in channels can only be a good thing in my humble opinion.
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Dean



Joined: 11 Mar 2003
Posts: 595
Location: London

PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2003 2:40 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I agree with both Rope and Graham and, as a licensed amateur, would be more than happy to part with a chunk of 70cms, an underused band in the UK anyway.

I think it unlikely to happen however, unfortunately, as any recall of these frequencies is more likely to go straight to commercial use providing more revenue than a licensed CB system ever could.

Dean
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ian



Joined: 15 Apr 2003
Posts: 109
Location: Notts.UK

PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2003 9:47 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Quote:



I agree with both Rope and Graham and, as a licensed amateur, would be more than happy to part with a chunk of 70cms, an underused band in the UK anyway.


Sorry to sound negative but if a part of 70cms went anywhere it would be to commercial users (PMR).
I bet 934Mhz was an interesting (UHF) band icon_smile.gif
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Guest






PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2003 11:19 pm Reply with quote Back to top

To quote "guest"

and as a radio ham myself I do mind giving up part of any ham band for the likes of people who do not respect other people on radio.

So does this mean that you would NOT mind responsible radio user to take over parts of the ham bands?

I would agree with Dean and others, the 70cm band is under-used, certainly round here.
But sadly i can hear a few ticket holders on 446 using more than 500mw....

Now for my controversial bit. The sooner the licence is scrapped the better. Perhaps then the bands may be a bit more entertaining than Colin and Frank talking about their latest experiment with a piece of bent wire for an hour on the local repeater. (sorry to all Colins/Franks)
By being conservative and narrow-minded enough to belive that a bit of paper with a callsign on it guarantees that the person will be responsible for his/her actions on the airwaves is very naive. People will always abuse certain forms of media, its nothing new.
You are right that some form of policing is needed, but sadly this may never happen, as the cost to the government will be prohibative.
But this is all academic of course, as Dean said, the frequencies would be sold to the highest bidder....more money in the pot!
robg



Joined: 27 May 2003
Posts: 35

PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2003 1:42 am Reply with quote Back to top

sorry all, it seems i was not logged in when i left the above message.

robg
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AndyJE



Joined: 29 Jul 2003
Posts: 31
Location: Jersey, UK Channel Isles

PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2003 9:32 am Reply with quote Back to top

Quote:
"By being conservative and narrow-minded enough to belive that a bit of paper with a callsign on it guarantees that the person will be responsible for his/her actions on the airwaves is very naive. "


I'd rather see a doctor with a piece of paper framed on his wall than one who didn't... that bit of paper can mean a lot! An M3 callsign might not mean a great deal these days, but other callsigns begining with G or M *DO* mean something - the operator knows a lot more about radio than the average 'man on the street'.
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Dean



Joined: 11 Mar 2003
Posts: 595
Location: London

PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2003 10:18 am Reply with quote Back to top

Quote:
The sooner the licence is scrapped the better.


Not sure I have this straight - are you suggesting the scrapping of the amateur radio licence or something else?

Dean
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Guest






PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2003 1:13 pm Reply with quote Back to top

with the advent of the mm3 call ham radio has never been so easy to get into.

i have always said that spot channels on 70cms for family/spouse use would very handy to have,with ctcss on tx/rx a must this would be very well used by radio ham and the wifes/family to contact each other or the licence holder or 2 or 4 channels at the most.

put we are not talking about about ham radio here we are talking about a general use puplic access system on uhf,very true,there are some dodgey people on 27mhz,but a lot of those people have gone over to ham radio,so does this make most radio hams dodgey,i dont think so.

the peole that abuse radio are only a small amount,most are only using it for one thing and that to make contact with family and friends,446 is open to every one to use,there is no licence and the RA as far as i know dont police it,but i would be in favour of a uhf cb system with a licenc fee and heavy fines for people who dont pay up,radio could transmit a ESN at the start of eash tx in a small burst of data,this data could contain info about the radio owner,and if they are a licence payer,there info could even be display on the other persons radio so you would know if you were talking to a legal station,the technoligy is there to do this and make it a workable system,there is no reason for licence non payer to get a way with it,you cant even buy a tv out a shop with out giving you name and address details,that then get checked on in the future.

regards to all de brian gm7
Guest






PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2003 1:00 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Quote:

so does this make most radio hams dodgey

I never said that most hams are dodgy, there are some dodgy folk no matter were your go though,

But most people that took there ham exam that was on CB did it to get away from the scum that was on there.

But know it seems that some hams don't mind if people take away part of a band that they did a lot of hard work to use. ( whats going on ) ?
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